伟大领袖最重要的特质是什么?什么样的企业可称之为达到了禅宗所谓的“顿悟(enlightened)”?如何构建一种企业文化,让员工有在初创公司工作的“错觉”?作为一家IT巨头的掌门人,是什么让史维学博士夜不能寐?……

Infosys首席执行官兼执行总经理史维学博士(Dr. Vishal Sikka)近日接受英国广播电台(BBC)In the Balance节目采访。上述问题的答案,他来为你揭晓。


(以下内容时间的时间节点为021004061134141819382450


主持人:史维学博士,我们从你开始。你曾就职于多家公司,看它们从名不见经传成长成国际巨头。在你的职业发展生涯中,你觉得哪些因素对成功比较重要?

史维学博士:众所周知,关于管理的哲学可以说是车载斗量,但是,归根结底,我发现伟大的领袖身上都有一项共同的特质,那就是——激情。我们目前还没有发明出可以测试激情的方法。但是,激情是这样一种特质:一旦你看到它,你知道那就是激情。

Colm O'Regan: And Vishal, I’m going to start with you. You’ve been around companies as they have grown from the bottom up. What have you noticed on your way up the ladder that seemed important to success?

Dr. Vishal Sikka: You know, there are tons of management philosophies, but in the end, the one common thing that I find in great leaders is passion. And we still don’t have a test for passion. But if you will, it is one of those things that you know it when you see it.
主持人:史维学博士,在你漫长的职业生涯中,你一定经历过商业图景翻天覆地的变化。以当前变化的速度来看,要构建一种动态机制促使一家企业获取竞争优势,是不是会比以前更难?

史维学博士:我觉得,恰恰相反,要让一个企业采纳新观念,当前比任何时候都更容易。无处不在的连接,数字基础设施的草根化趋势,让我们能够比以往任何时候更快地将新想法变成现实。有趣的是,在一个顿悟的组织,企业没有理由不能取得同样的竞争优势。所以,我的感觉是,在我们所生活的时代,将新想法变成现实实际上比以往任何时候都容易。在很大程度上,企业似乎是被颠覆了,被创新蒙蔽了双眼,而究其原因是因其自身所作所为。

主持人:你如何定义一个“顿悟的组织”?

史维学博士:我的意思是,如果你看看过去 的100年,以美国为例,100年前,90%的企业是在农业领域的。现在,这一比例仅为不到3%。美国发生了翻天覆地的变化。我们必须具备这种能力,利用当前资源,洞察客户需求,把握市场脉搏,从而交付具有生命力的产品和服务。教育,以及训练有素的员工,是我们目前所拥有的最宝贵的资源。因此,我指的“顿悟”实际上是说,根据市场需求,赋予员工适当的技能和能力的能力。

Colm O'Regan: Vishal, you must have seen the business landscape change enormously over your career so far. Is it more difficult now to build the kind of dynamics that give a company a competitive advantage that allows it to grow, say, at the pace we’ve seen so far?

Dr. Vishal Sikka: My sense is that it is the opposite, that, it is easier than ever to get a company going, to adopt new ideas. The pervasive connectivity, the massive availability of digital infrastructure makes it possible to bring ideas to life at a speed that is faster than ever before. The interesting thing is that in an enlightened organization, there is no reason why companies can’t have the same advantages. So my sense is that, the time we live it, it is in fact easier than it has ever been to bring new ideas to life. And to a large degree, companies seem to get disrupted, seem to get blinded by innovation, primarily because of their own doing.

Colm O'Regan: What do you define as an enlightened organization?

Dr. Vishal Sikka: I mean, if you look at, let’s say over the last 100 years, if you look at the United States, 100 years ago, 90% of the companies was in farming. Now it is less than 3%. It is a vastly different country. You have to have the ability to deliver the right products and services based on what is available, what is necessary and what is relevant. And education and a workforce that is trained to do that, to make that happen is the biggest mechanism that we have by far. So when I say enlightened, it really mean the ability to bring the right skills and capabilities to the workforce based on what is needed. 
主持人: Infosys是否考虑过将非洲作为其消费者、员工、领导人、程序员的来源地?

史维学博士:当然。如果你看看我们的产品,我们的Finacle银行系统是非洲国家以及在非洲学生群体中使用最广的银行平台。正如James刚刚谈到,金字塔正在被倒过来。我们必须激发从下至上的创新理念。那种CEO和领导层高高在上,对底层员工的行为思想洞若观火的观念已不合时宜。我们必须持之以恒地在组织内打造这样一种文化,即,创新来自于第一线员工,并鼓励草根层面的创新。创新不是一小撮端坐在Pala Alto、柏林或其它地方的精英分子拍脑袋想出来的。每一个人都会更多地参与到创新之旅。我认为,这一点对于组织的成功将愈发关键。

Colm O'Regan: Vishal, is Infosys thinking about Africa in terms of its source of consumers, workers, leaders, coders?

Dr. Vishal Sikka: Oh, absolutely. If you look at our product. Our Finacle banking product is the largest banking platform for African countries and for African students. As James talked about, the pyramid is becoming reversed. There is a sense of bottom-up innovation that we need to enable. And this idea of that CEO and leadership team sitting on the top of the organization, somehow knows more about what was going on that everybody on the ground is just nonsense. We have to create a culture increasingly in organizations that innovation is at the frontlines, innovation at the grassroots in encouraged. And not just have innovation just done by, you know elite, small groups sitting in Palo Alto, Berlin or somewhere. But everyone getting more involved in that journey. I think that increasingly is the key to success in organization.


主持人: 令一个企业经受住时间考验其中最重要的一项特质便是,该企业与竞争对手互动,并打败竞争对手的能力。史维学博士,竞争的概念是不是也在发生变化,您怎么看?

史维学博士:当然。我非常赞同。我们认为,我们越来越多地需要与其它公司合作并竞争。胜利是一场零和游戏,即,一方胜利必然以另一方的失败为代价,在我看来,是越来越不合时宜了。我们在与自己竞争。我们在与自己满足客户需求,达成客户期望的能力竞争。我认为,在一个日渐普遍连接、透明的世界——我们正生活在并逐步过渡到这样的世界——其挑战与其说在于赢得竞争,不如说在于如何更贴近客户。

主持人:你如何实现平衡?因为,很明显,股东愿意投资的是表现最好,最高的股价。更多协作的观念能否带来股价的上扬?

史维学博士:嗯,你的问题包含几个点。协作,利益相关人(不妨说是股东和分析师)的评估,以及客户相关性。我认为这是几个不同的概念。对于分析师如何提高我们的评级,我认为,正如史蒂芬·乔布斯所言,你只有在回首往事时才能将生命中的点连接起来。因此,你只需要交付结果,交付价值,分析师爱怎么比较是他们的事情。我是这么认为的。当然你可以提供指标和衡量参数,帮助分析师做分析,不过原因和结果不能混为一谈。我们必须用我们的所作所为对自身进行衡量。合作也至关重要。今天,我们在与各方开展合作,在许多情况下不清楚其他人做了什么。我们越是清楚认识到合作的文化能够增强我们的能力,就越是能够取得共赢。 

Colm O'Regan: One of the things that enable a company to stand the test of time is its ability to interact and best the competitors. If I can start with you, Vishal, the notion of competition is that changing as well.

Dr. Vishal Sikka: Absolutely. I think so. Increasingly, my sense is that we live in a world where we continually to cooperate and compete with other companies. And this idea of Zero Sum which is we win at the expense of somebody else, is in my view, increasingly becoming less relevant. We compete with ourselves. We compete with our ability to deliver what our customers demand, what our customers deserve. And I think more and more in a pervasively connected, in a transparent world that we are living in and that we are moving to, that challenge is not so much being better than the competition, but being better than the threshold of relevance to the customer.

Colm O'Regan: How do you balance that though, because obviously the shareholders are people who invest want to invest in the one with the highest,  best-performing share price. Is the philosophy of more collaboration, does that translate to share price gain?

Dr. Vishal Sikka: Well, there are several points in your question. The collaboration, the ability of stakeholders like shareholders and analysts to evaluate us, and the relevance to the customer. I think those are different things. In terms of enabling analysts to better compare what we do, I think, you know, as Steve Jobs once said, you can only connect the dots looking backwards. So, you deliver your results, you deliver your value, and then let the analysts compare you do whatever they feel like comparing. That is sort I go about this. You can obviously give metrics and measures that, help them do their analysis, but one can’t confuse cause and effect. We have to measure ourselves by what we have done. And collaboration is absolutely critical. I think we are collaborating today with various parties, I think in some cases without realizing what others have done. And the more we realize that a collaborative culture amplifies our abilities to become better, the easier the entire thing becomes. 

主持人:在Infosys这样一个庞大的企业,您如何让员工感到他们仍然是在为一家初创公司效力?

史维学博士:过去一年,我们投入了大量的精力打造这样一种企业文化。目前,我们共有8300多个项目,由8300多个出类拔萃的项目经理领导,他们的年龄都在35岁以下。我们想做的一件事情就是改变这些项目的观念,真正地激发每一个项目进行创新,来一点创意。因此,除了激励项目经理和团队在本项目中加入创新元素之外,我们还为员工提供设计思维培训。这个世界上存在形形色色的工作,你会发现,越来越多的工作,之前它们被转移到印度或离岸外包,现在已经可以借助自动化技术完成了。因此,工作的性质正在改变,人力被自动化取代,人要成为自动化技术的创造者。通过自动化技术节省的精力,提高的效率,必须转化成创意、创新,用来解决无法用自动化技术完成的任务。因此,我现在做的一件事情就是,我走进斯坦福大学设计学院的课堂。他们有一套很棒的方法论,叫做设计思维,可以重新激活我们的创意,帮助人们建立信心发挥创意。在过去14个月,我们为79000名员工提供了设计思维培训。Infosys的规模令我们可以大范围培训教育我们的员工,完成这一壮举。这79000名员工并不会因为上了一天设计思维课程变成设计师,但是,这种体验可以再次触发员工的好奇心,点燃员工追问“为什么”的热情。这将会带来巨大的变化。
 
Colm O'Regan: Vishal, in a large company such as Infosys, how do you make people feel they are still in a startup?

Dr. Vishal Sikka: So we have spent a lot of effort on this over the last year. If you look at Infosys, we have right now about 8300 projects that are going on, run by 8300 bright project managers, well, all below the age of 35. And one of the things we wanted to do was the change the perception of these kinds of projects and really inspire everyone of these projects to do something innovative, to do something creative. So beyond inspiring project managers and project teams to find innovation in their own projects, we also train people on design thinking. If you look at the world of jobs, more and more of the kinds of jobs that were shifting to India or were being off shored and so forth, now, it is becoming possible to do these jobs with automation. So the nature of the work has to shift to a point where people who are being displaced by automation have to become creator of the automation. And then the bandwidth we saved with automation, the productivity that we improved with automation, had to be channeled towards creativity, towards innovation, towards the kind of things that we don’t have automation for. So one of the things we did, was, I’m sitting here in Stanford campus and the Stanford D School. The Design School has a great methodology called design thinking, to sort of re-inspire our creativity, to help people get more creative confidence. And we have in the last 14 months trained 79000 people on dT. And that is something, the kind of scale at which a company like Infosys can impart training and education helps us do things like that. And these 79,000 people, they don’t become designers after a day-long design thinking class, but it does act as a switch that you can be curious again, you can ask why again. And that makes a huge difference.

主持人:作为一家大企业的CEO,在一个无畏的新世界竞争,在思考如何发展Infosys时是什么让你彻夜难眠?

史维学博士:我们一直有一个基本的信念,那就是,在这个瞬息万变的世界,我们有能力适时地变革我们的企业文化。当下我们面临的世界可以说是数字时代,连接的时代,智能的时代,我们具备非凡的能力来服务这个时代。根本的挑战在于我们自身。Herman Hesse(德国作家,于1946年获得诺贝尔文学奖)在他的小说《悉达多》(Siddhartha)中写道,知识是可以被传播的,甚至思想,但是智慧不能被言喻。每个人都必须找到自己的智慧。最最令我夜不能寐的事情就是,我相信,我们能够找到“Infosys之道”。
 
Colm O'Regan: Our final word to Vishal, as CEO of a big company competing in this brave new world, what keeps you awake at night when you think about trying to grow Infosys?

Dr. Vishal Sikka: It’s the basic equation that we will be able to transform our culture, in time, with all the changes that are happening all around us. We have extraordinary ability to serve the times that are in front of us, the digital times, the connected times, the intelligent times. And the challenge fundamentally is within us. You know, Herman Hesse said in his book Siddhartha that knowledge can become indicated, and thought, but not wisdom, we all have to find out our own wisdom. And more than anything else the thing that keeps me up at night is that we’ll all be able to find it in time.